Thursday = Thor's day
2010-05-07
Last week we had dinner at a quiet restaurant on the Oregon coast, and sat near two people that were obviously on a first date. (“So, do you have any siblings?”)
When their conversation took an interesting turn, we couldn't help but listen:
“You're an atheist? How can you not believe in God?”
“How can you not believe in Zeus or Thor?”
“That's stupid. Those are old folk-tales.”
“They were God! You're dismissing others' beliefs, calling them folk-tales? So you're also an atheist for most gods that have ever existed. I just go one further.”
“I'm not an atheist!”
“You and I are almost identical in our beliefs! If history has named, say, 520 gods, you don't believe in 519 of them, I don't believe in 520 of them.”
...(long pause)...
“What do you do on Christmas or Easter, then? Do you feel weird as a non-believer?”
“What do you do on Thursday?”
“Huh?”
“Thursday was named after Thor. It's Thor's day. Do you feel weird as a non-believer?”
“That's not fair.”
“All the English days of the week are named after gods, sun, and moon. Look it up on Wikipedia. It's wild.”
“Why are you so into this?”
“I'm not. Spent maybe 20 minutes on it, tops. I'm not on a mission to dis-prove God any more than you're on a mission to dis-prove Zeus. It's really no big deal to me.”
“So, I guess we're not compatible, huh?”
“Of course we are! I like you a lot. And we do agree on 519 of the gods, so we'll just not mention that last one.”
“OK. Deal. I like you a lot, too.”
...(long pause)...
“So what's your favorite band?”
“Oh, God.”
I always love an opposite point of view. Then I liked the reframing of the situation from “we're opposite” to “we agree on 519 of the 520 gods.”
We went home and looked up the etymology of the English days of the week, and found:
- Thursday: named for Thor, who gets his own blockbuster movie next year
- Friday: named for Frige, the love goddess
- Saturday: named for Saturn, Roman god of agriculture
- Sunday: the sun's day
- Monday: the moon's day
- Tuesday: named for Tiw, the god of single combat, later equated with Mars, the Roman god of war
- Wednesday: named for Woden aka Odin, head god of almost everything, maybe a precursor to Father Christmas or Santa Claus, and will be played by Anthony Hopkins in Thor's movie, bringing it all back around
I love that we're living in a time where it's so easy to learn.
Like the date asked, “Why are you so into this?” - When I was a kid, you had to be “so into” something to go to the trouble of going to the library to find books on a subject, or going back to the card catalog to find related books.
It used to be that if you overheard someone say something, you'd just remember and repeat it, without looking it up for yourself, because it wasn't worth the trouble.
Now you can start to dive into any subject with some whimsical web browsing - an alternate to watching a TV show. And because I invested so little time into it, I'm emotionally less invested into subscribing to it (“signing my name to it”) - and can see it as just an alternate point of view.
This is great!
I'm so into this story
Thor, the Viking! Of course, he deserves a day. Btw, thank you for your tech help a few weeks ago. Got everything working, and am developing an Education section now: http://education.bluemusicgroup.com
Pretty amusing story.
It IS so easy to learn. I often get asked questions by people - and plenty of times I don't know the answer either.
But, then, I actually go and look it up, find out everything I can about the thing, and tell them about it.
They could have done it, and saved themselves the time of asking me.
On the other hand, I have to thank them for asking, because now I know all kinds of interesting information as a result.
I suppose some people just have hungrier minds than others.
The thing I like about Paganism is it makes the environment sacred. Most people are quite respectful in a church. Imagine a belief system where sun, moon, wind, thunder, earth, everything is a god. We would not be in our current environmental predicament if we could recognize the gods in everything, instead of seeing it all as 'resources', to be mined, chopped down, and squandered on the silliest fancies we can think up.
This is awesome: 'Then I liked the reframing of the situation from “we're opposite” to “we agree on 519 of the 520 gods.” '
A great example of the power of positive thinking.
I heard this a lot as a kid -> "How does he know that stuff? He probably spends hours reading the Encyclopedia. He needs to get a life."
Now, that doesn't exist.
Immediacy has destroyed any ability for people to tear you down for knowledge, and that's awesome. I'm sure we'll find some other way to do it, but for now -- I travel to Wikipedia.
hilarious...i'm sending this to many of my friends
I love this, both your blog and also being able to research something so quickly on the Net. My husband of 16 years and I both love to debate & discuss things. In the past few years discussions are more like, "Well, I disagree. When we get home, let's just Google it and check it out." And then the subject is dropped until we're home and get the facts. It's brought oodles of harmony into our relationship - just because facts and information are so conveniently available. Wonderful.
Hahah! Hilarious story... and some great lessons to learn. I am sure you guys are SO enjoying your trip!!
Thanks, instructive example for the religious folks.
This is a good one Derek! Enjoyed reading and learning very much. Thank you.
HI Derek, great to hear from you again and read your writing..there is an artist in Montreal many years ago that dropped in on people's conversations and wrote them down and then sculpted onto a circular piece of marble and engraved the samples of conversations around in a circle into the marble and then planted these huge conversational sculptures into a part of a mountain area. So while people walk they discover if they are curious these pieces of conversations written in stone so to speak for generations. Conversations captured in time that last for lifetimes. Fragmentations of human existance into words then transformed into art. this of course is not the internet however we must not forget that there are so many ways of expressing words and definitions. Thanks for teaching me the meanings behind the days of the week. Happy and safe travels Derek, Mark
Great true story! Thanks for Sharing!
It least the couple had their facts straight. Too many people just pass on Legends without checking them first. If a person is going to learn they should at least learn it correctly!!!
I love it! 1st century "Christians" called themselves "Followers of The Way." Followers of Zeus (or Diana or…), particularly those with a strong ideological worldview, rather than a spiritual way of seeing life, referred to these "Christians" with a new (new to 1st century ears) pejorative: atheists.
Thorsday
Heh. I live a similar scene day to day living in the beautiful bible belt.
Not dissimilar to Kevin Smith dialog at a Barbecue, while holdin' a sweet tea.
Keep on posting.
peace-
seanrox
love this. I'm going to use it on my religious folks.
Lovely story.
-- Derek
Concerning that transcript, did you record it or how accurate is it, really?
Wasn't that hard to remember, since it made an impression and we talked about it right afterwards.
Yeah baby... Love it!
That's why I like the phrase 'your religious preference'. There's no substitute for intelligence and education.
Great piece, Derek. I also love the fact that it's so easy to dive into an endless sea of information about pretty much anything. It's a cultural mindwarp that we are barely beginning to see the effects of -- and those effects are already profound.
Excellent. We humans evolve through integrating our traditions and myths with current events to create our futures. It's all politics when you have two or more people.
Jaja! Funny story... It's a perfect scene for a movie... i really don't know where that relationship will go... best of luck and loads of patience! but i guess that's the best way to make a point when people are so attached to their beliefs that they claim everyone else is wrong, no questions asked... kudos to the atheist...
Another good story--thanks Derek! Great to hear from you again.
What you're referring to a usually described as the Norse pantheon, but aspects of it were used my many Germanic tribes.
It gets really interesting when you start really digging back into the history of the characters in that pantheon.
While you're at it, look up a people known as the Russ.
Do you collect your bloggy bits like a songwriter carrying around little scraps of paper that become songs later?
I think it's smashing that you overheard that couple's conversation and framed it into a perfectly open-minded discussion about keeping an open mind.
It's funny how someone can stop making music and still continue rocking out harder than ever.
The world's your stage! I love your show!
I love the word play here...so yummy. And topical; I just agreed to disagree with a fundie friend for having her own belief that her god would take care of the itty bitty oil spill in the gulf (the news told her it wasn't *that* bad) while she continues to live an abundant life. She says he doesn't need our help.
!!!
I'll continue to ride my bicycle on my carless path and eat my vegetarian fare and be the change I want to see in the world. I have a feeling her god might *want* my help, even if he doesn't need it. Namaste'.
Legos are cool.
Couldn't resist (LOL)
I admire your curiosity Derek. As far as I can tell, the days of the week are named after gods only in the English language.
http://needGod.com
Ha! Love it! Especially that a discussion like this didn't ruin the date (I'd love to see the couple five years from now!).
I think the non-attachment value you point out is really the key. By being attached to so much less, whether it's information or dogma of any sort, it really leaves room for the smaller amount of "important" stuff (whatever that means to us). So many times we refer to this in the physical world, but it works equally, if not even moreso, in the abstract.
And now "Friday I'm in Love" is going to be stuck in my head all weekend!
Interesting Arguement
Interesting Arguement Derek
here, let me google that for you
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=thor%27s+day
It is interesting to me when we are so in awe of other people's opinions that we believe to be so different than ours when in fact they are very similar. I feel that sometimes we are so invested in our beliefs we throw a red flag down at even the slightest possibility of opposition to our beliefs. Even more interesting is how many times the conversation becomes heated when we are basically saying the same thing or have the same conviction, just using different words to communicate.
I know I am guilty of this. Conversations with some of my friends always have an underlying feel of an argument waiting to blow all because we are not really openly listening to what is being said but an opinion that we have assigned. I wonder if one possible reason is because in our fast paced society, people often feel unheard.
It would be curious to see how this exchange would have ended had this couple been at a cocktail party instead on a date where they were forced to continue to interact. My bet would be that these two people would have walked away from each other thinking that the other was ignorant and mentally calling them an expletive only to see them again 2 years later where they end up getting married!
Reframing has to be one of the most powerful psychological tools around. Your story showcased it brilliantly, thanks for sharing.
“Man is all Imagination and God is Man and Exists in us and we in Him. The Eternal Body of Man is the Imagination and that is God Himself.” (William Blake)
realneville.com
Well Derek, looks like you and yours are having a great trip. Like everything else in life, it is what you make of the situation & these folks comming together across such a polarizing gap as well as the joy I imagine you folks got from it is great.
I predict these two will have a successful and lengthy nuptial agreement situation and perhaps leave a legacy of additional intelligent and thoughtful human progeny.
I was just thinking of Legos!! (i like the little Lego guy---that's you, right?)
# Sunday: the sun's day - dedicated to the God Apollo
# Monday: the moon's day - dedicated to the Goddess Diana
or whatever...
And can I just say - I love your little Thor... with his oh, so powerful hammer!
I really appreciated the reframing of You don't believe in 519 Gods and I don't believe in 520 Gods... We're just one different.
But what really spoke to me, was how he moved her off her intolerant standing in judgment into a place of curiosity. From "that's stupid" to "Well, what do you do..."
As long as we're curious about people and ourselves (as opposed to fixed judgment and assumption), we have room to grow, to develop, to relate and to live together in peace.
I not only love "living in a time where it's so easy to learn," but I'm especially grateful to be old enough to truly appreciate it. Nearly every time I pull out my smartphone to look something up, I marvel at how this was beyond the realm of my imagination when I was a child.
Glad to see you writing again Derek, BTW your kinda good at it
This is a unique example of a person that spent time focused on the validity of his\her beliefs and will no longer blindly follow the masses.
Big Props for allowing us to vicariously live through your insights.
haha, marcsday
I have often wondered how many people of the cloth fully accept the supernatural?
Reframing - The Trial Lawyer's best friend.
I have often wondered how many people of the cloth fully accept the supernatural?
What people mean by "learn" is a kind of Roscharch test about what they believe learning is. For example, I teach science for a day job. I find that people can know the name of something, it's definition, and some of it's special attributes, but still fail to recognize examples of the concept when they see it. So looking things up on line may help people learn names, definitions and attributes, but leave them totally unable to function in the area of study.
Further, as in your story example, people may develop clever arguments and rebuttals on a subject, yet fail to see their own inconsistencies. Each religion has a set of principles that seem perfectly logical to those who choose to accept them. They are generally called Articles of Faith. Atheism has it's own set of Articles of Faith which each practitioner has chosen to believe.
The internet allows a certain kind of learning to occur, which I use and am grateful for. However, it leads many people to have a false sense of confidence about what they know to be true, and allows people to promulgate their own articles of faith as if they were fact.
So in some ways the internet may be a very misleading place.
Derek,
Great Post. My learning as accelerated exponentially because of the easy access to information.
However, the thirst for knowledge does seem to get in the way of the non-learning essential tasks of the day
Please keep writing.
Congratulations on your wedding!
Who then is the god of Legos?
Wicked!
Erick
Hi Derek,
I like that your "I" stories are turning to "we." Ain't married life grand!
When arguing is it more important to be right or to get along?
I love the diversity of thought because life would be boring without it. Vive la difference!
I didn’t know about the origin of the week days. Thanks for that.
By the way, I’m pretty sure I have that same Lego character somewhere within the 1000s of other Lego pieces stored in my house.
Happy traveling.
haha.. Wikipedia. reminds me of that john fogerty song.. "and I know it's true.. oh so true, cause I saw it on t.v."
I'm always amazed when people go to the trouble of posting questions to online forums which they could answer for themselves with one or two clicks. I love this sea of information we live in, all of the planet throughout all of history at our fingertips - how lucky am I to be here and now?
I think all the things we imagine divide us probably can be distilled down to "we agree on 519 out of 520" but sometimes that last one is deal-breaker. But just sometimes. It's good to find all the opportunities for 519 to be enough.
That's a really good story about the stupid things that keep people from coming together and achieving great things. Maybe we created Gods so we could have an excuse to separate ourselves.
As an aside, in Latin the days of the week are only slightly different but correspond to the gods you mentioned.
Lunes - Monday - Luna
Martes - Tuesday - Mars
Miercoles - Wednesday - Mercury
Thursday - Jueves - Jupiter
Viernes - Friday - Venus
Sabado - Saturday - Saturn
It doesn't matter where one comes from or what they believe. We are all influenced by these archetypes in one form or another... as your story so eloquently shows.
Frigg-Frija (goddess naming Friday), she has a coach that was pulled by Norwegian Forest Cats. How cool is that! She must be very determined to steer cats in the right direction. I have a Norwegian Forest Cat - Rasputin- would not like to have several of him pulling a coach!Too difficult.
Fun facts of mythology.
One last thing before I forget Derek, and you already knows this. If there really is a God, it is Love.
Nice story but I think your comment about learning being so easy these days, a little problematic. To learn something deeply requires effort and ,ideally,passion for the subject.Acquiring info bites from Wikipedia is a shallow simulacrum of learning,not learning itself. The ease of access might even be more of a hindrance than an advantage in this regard.I also think getting one's information from the internet is equivalent to everyone dipping into the same source for knowledge,runs the risk of stifling variety. A situation such as Leibniz and Newton,discovering calculus independently,through different reasoning,would probably not arise these days.
Very clever of you to not even mention which was the male female, or both the same....
I just over heard their second date.. they discussed the relevance that their first date was in April:
April -- Aphrodite's month...Aphrodite is the Greek goddess of love and beauty.
Reframing is a great technique. However, when facing a long term deeply held belief, sometimes the smart move is to not play the game at all. See the movie "WarGames".
Nice story but I think your comment about learning being so easy these days, a little problematic. To learn something deeply requires effort and ,ideally,passion for the subject.Acquiring info bites from Wikipedia is a shallow simulacrum of learning,not learning itself. The ease of access might even be more of a hindrance than an advantage in this regard.I also think getting one's information from the internet is equivalent to everyone dipping into the same source for knowledge,runs the risk of stifling variety. A situation such as Leibniz and Newton,discovering calculus independently,through different reasoning,would probably not arise these days.
Just for the info:
In Spanish:
Lunes - moon's day
martes - mar's day
miercoles - mercury's day
jueves - ???
viernes - ???
sabado - Saturn's day
domingo - Dominic's day (???)
In German:
Montag - Mond Tag (Moon day)
Dienstag - ??
Mittwoch - Mitte der Woche (Middle of the Week)
Donnerstag - Thunder day, or Thor's (The God of Thunder) Day
Freitag - Free Day
Samstag / Sonnabend - ?? / Sun's Eve
Sonntag - Sun Day
One correction: "Odin, head god of almost everything, maybe a precursor to Father Christmas or Santa Claus" - "Santa Claus" (Spanish) originating from the Dutch "Sinter Klaas" - Saint Claus or Saint Nikolaus.
Saint Nikolaus was a Cardinal from Turkey (Constantinople) who performed many act of charity for the poor and for children.
For years I'd drive by this large buildong, then it became a campus, & all it had was the word "cogent" on it.
A quick trip to wiki found me exactly what a cool & amazing company it is!
Not that I really care anymore. My curiosity is satisfied.
Hi Derek..Thanx again for sharing parts of your life with this group..The story made me feel quite intense, like are they gonna go mad on eachother? Sad if they really like eachother! Alot of thinking while I was carring on reading, and in the end I really start laughing, I believe in You ;)
Osh
Thanks for sharing such mind provoking ideas, Derek and everyone!
No one knows who God is exactly and they are lying if they say they do. You have to jump to a leap of faith to believe in any of the gods, so which jump of faith is correct? I do love the unknown spirituality and mystery surrounding our existance and find that clearing the mind through meditation gets us closest to a reality of the greater picture. But, I may be completely wrong there.
Here is what is amazing to me, Although I hardly know you, and wouldn't really if I hadn't been a greed head back a few years, and subscribed (signed my name too)to your amazingly simple marketing site. That I can ALWAYS count on you to post the most provocative and different items on the web.
thanks for your perception and creativity!
Best,
Michael
PS. I like you too!
Derek, great story and it really does come down to respecting each other's beliefs. A great insight into the new world (past 2012) where a higher consistent energy (without a name) may be a single leading force and thus, less arguments.
Cooool... How's the honeymoon with your lovely soulmate going Derek?!.
-- Derek
Rest of our life is our honeymoon
my last name is Thurman. it is directly derivetive of Thor. the old name was Thor-mund which actually meant under Thor's hand, or under Thor's protection. a group of the "Thor" people (who came from the Danes) took over part
of the east of England during the Viking Age. that's where my "Thor" ancestors come from. so me and Uma and thousands of others are all related to a tribe of people that goes back long before a thousand years ago.
now let me say this. I'm proud of my name, but I don't put a whole lot of stock in gods and godesses. Every human culture that ever lived has created gods and godesses or the "idea" of gods and godesses in order to struggle with the question of where they came from or the greater meaning of life
and death. I cannot blame them for this. it's a truly legitimate response to the human condition. however, when Totalitarian Power Groups like the many under the banner of "Christian" or "Judaic" or "Muslim" or any other organized religion try to tell me and others what we can think and feel and what we CANNOT think and feel, that is where I draw the line. I will never submit to anybody else's power trip or power dogma.
Even the word "God" is just a word and a very general one at that. (it's Germanic actually) So let's all just try to get along and let "The Supreme Being" hold sway over the universe in the way that IT sees fit. I honestly believe that the Dalai Lama has a very good view on the idea of "god" and mankind . . . at least a damn good sight better than many others.
Bill
I'm reading Virus of the Mind right now and couldn't help thinking of memes as I read this. What a hilarious exchange! Thanks for passing it along ;-)
I hope they can work it out.
Logic can be such a wonderful thing sometimes.
I'm holding firm to the prospect of #521.
LxoJ
Your point of the story reminds me of a friend. She was telling my wife that to find some story "just go to Yahoo and Google it".
En Español:
Lunes: Luna (Moon)
Martes: Marte (Mars)
Miércoles: Mercurio (Mercury)
Jueves: Júpiter (Jupiter, or Zeus, god of thunder in roman mythology)
Viernes: Venus (Venus, or Aphrodite)
Sábado: Saturno (Saturn)
Domingo: Día del Señor, (Lord's Day, from Latin: "Domine" Lord)
Did some people miss the point that your story was about information, and not about religion?
Great story! Thanks for sharing Derek!
The guy reminded me Zeus, the supreme Greek god of the heavens, who, although the leader of the gods and protector of the world had far too many human weaknesses, challenging many times Hera (his legal wife) with his controversies and his adventures.
And just for the info: Thursday-Thor's day
Latin: dies Jovis "day of Jupiter"
Ancient Greek: hemera Dios "day of Zeus".
Cheers and enjoy your travel!
Joanna
First man: "Is this the train to Wimbly?"
Second man: "No, today's Thursday."
Third man: "Me too! Let's go have a drink!"
If life is meant to be a carnival; this story is a ride on the merry-go-round. Thank you.
I think it's a neat story. I believe in God myself...but I'm not hung up on it.
I just loved that lovers' point of view.
For some unknown reason when I was reading the post, I couldn't help but think that the one who was making the point of Thor and Zeus was the man.
There is always two sides of a story,a human, shitty sticks etc... The believe ones blame the athiest vs.So even those whom are athiest are shitty as the believe ones.
Being of Viking heritage myself, I was amused by the naming of Thursday for Thor. ( My Dad called me Thor as a kid ) he always signed his scorecard with Thor after a round of golf !
True true, but the other side of the coin is that it is possible just to spend toooooooo much time on the internet.
Right! Time for me to shut this computer and log off then, now...well maybe.
From BigThink (on the topic of Atheism):
"The atheist is actually a neo-religious individual who has built himself a God in the form of human Reason, and he bows down before his Lord of Reason, and worships at its altar.
In fact, there exists an organization known as The Reason Project, a de facto, non-profit church for the God doubters, where they can meet, bond, and rejoice in the concept of human omniscience. In order to belong to their exalted fraternity/sorority, it is imperative that the atheist share a common disdain for the spiritualists of the world. Moreover, in the atheist's mind, the ultimate sinner is the scientist who clings to faith and refuses to pay homage to Reason as the ultimate power.
The worship of Reason is human hubris to the extreme and any organization that venerates Reason must ultimately renounce its primary antagonist, namely......Heart. The logical extrapolation of Reason to all universal matters precludes considerations of Heart.
It is the demands of Reason that allow humans to torture animals in experiments "for the greater good." It is the demands of Reason that emboldened the Nazis to experiment upon Jews for purposes of achieving expeditious medical epiphanies. It is the demands of Reason that require all "irrationalists" to be impugned and ridiculed.
By what right does the human animal insist that his definition of what is real, relevant, or appropriate must become the absolute verdict on all universal matters? By what right do Reason disciples feel that science should serve as the final arbiter of all universal considerations when, over the ages, virtually every school of scientific thought has been discredited in hindsight as being no more than the "voodoo of its day?"
In any choice between Reason or Heart, I will lean toward the latter...but, of course, that's just what "irrational" musicians do.
Derek - This is good stuff. I am a follower of Jesus Christ, not a Christian as used as an adjective to describe ones self, but a real walking it out with Jesus kind of guy. I say that to applaud you for your research. Most people go through their lives and never realize the pagan impact and followings that the world offers us without question. This is shocking to people. Christmas is not Jesus' birthday, its the celebration of it. The Bible tells us that he was probably born in the Spring. So much of the worlds system is built on Paganism and Christians operate under this everyday without question In the Bible it also talks about the Nephalim, is it possible that these gods that you speak of are results of Angels and women, are these the fallen angles that the Bible speaks of. I wish that everyone would stop taking another man's word for what they define as their beliefs and start studying the truth for themselves. Complacency is the root of all ignorance. Good one!!!
the only problem with the ease of sharing information is the equal easiness of sharing miss-information. say for instance derek had sneakly made-up or just plain old got wrong tuesdays etamology, because he and his site are very highly regarded hundreds of folks would just take his word for it (im pretty sure i will), without checking another source. hmmm what does that tell me? sure, it can be easy to fool people (no matter how easy to check out the info on days, how many have?) but to become the type of person who other ppl will take their word at face value - youve got to be honest & approchable, and then keep working at these attributes, no matter how innate they are. nice article derek, made me think that one did
Yes!! I'm stealing this as my answer to being a non-believer.
I think we tend to believe what is presented to us with love and as we grow in our understanding of love, we grow in our ability to recognize truth. Truth requires some things to not be true, as does belief. I don't think a person should stay "safely" in a state of "all truths are equal" if one has been presented something true and with love. And if one has not been presented something true and with love, then that's something to pray about. Or meditate, if that's the word you choose.
I really enjoyed the conversation and its findings. I lived in Portland back in 93. I have found it difficult to dismiss the founder of the idea to make us into DNA strands long enough to reach the moon. Moon Day. I stared at the moon one time for an hour. It didn't do much but get me into Pink Floyd more often. On Fridays.
Derek,
I am approaching very quickly 70 years of age. I enjoyed the read; the responses to your text enlighten me as to the more youthful thinking in todays all knowing culture ... which I find disturbing. But then ... I am almost 70 but I did grow up with instrumention and computers ... but that's another story.
After you read this ... ponder on it. This is from a personal event which I experienced, that occured in my life in July 1997.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
His head and [his] hairs [were] white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes [were] as a flame of fire;
And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:
And hast borne, and hast patience, and for my name's sake hast laboured, and hast not fainted.
He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God.
Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast [some] of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.
But I have a few things against thee, because thou hast there them that hold the doctrine of Balaam, who taught Balac to cast a stumblingblock before the children of Israel, to eat things sacrificed unto idols, and to commit fornication.
He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the hidden manna, and will give him a white stone, and in the stone a new name written, which no man knoweth saving he that receiveth [it].
And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden.
And I will give him the morning star.
Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.
¶ And to the angel of the church in Philadelphia write; These things saith he that is holy, he that is true, he that hath the key of David, he that openeth, and no man shutteth; and shutteth, and no man openeth;
Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.
¶ And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:
To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
And he that sat was to look upon like a jasper and a sardine stone: and [there was] a rainbow round about the throne, in sight like unto an emerald.
And the first beast [was] like a lion, and the second beast like a calf, and the third beast had a face as a man, and the fourth beast [was] like a flying eagle.
The four and twenty elders fall down before him that sat on the throne, and worship him that liveth for ever and ever, and cast their crowns before the throne, saying,
And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.
And he came and took the book out of the right hand of him that sat upon the throne.
And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.
And the four beasts said, Amen. And the four [and] twenty elders fell down and worshipped him that liveth for ever and ever.
¶ And when he had opened the second seal, I heard the second beast say, Come and see.
And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.
And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places.
For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?
Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
think ... sequence. Blessings
Next time someone tells you that he is an atheist, ask him exactly which God doesn't he believe in and describe It.
How to get your tires slashed:
Make up a bumpersticker:
(in big letters
THERE ARE NO ATHEISTS IN HEAVEN!
(in very small letters
- because there is no heaven -
Great post !
I'm just re-listening to the original radio series of The Hitch Hiker's Guide To The Galaxy on my iPhone.
Many times I've clicked into Safari to check my email, Twitter, the weather or get updates on progress in the UK's general election.
It keeps occurring to me that the geeky toy I'm listening using is effectively a ¨Hitch Hiker's Guide to the Earth¨ and a Star Trek communicator in one device, not to mention a camera, GPS and...
What's scary is how addictive the easy, instant information is, how lost I feel when I lose a network signal.
Ian
Whenever I receive one of "those" emails, I look up the salient points on snopes.com. Then, if it proves false, I 'reply all' citing snopes. Just my way of stopping the rot.
Let's rename Thursday to Maxday - after Maxwell's Silver Hammer...
By the way, Mark, it's Wembly.
Rastafari is the allmighty, trod throughout the hills and valley and dont keep up any fally,bibbically and I-tally.
I love the fact that today we can so quickly look up anything. On the other hand, your story brings up an interesting quandary brought about by the subject matter the couple was discussing- Is there real "truth" to be found, or only relative opinions? Jesus said He was the way, the truth and the life. As a follower of Him, I obviously believe that truth is not relative. If it's truth, then not everyone has it. I know it's not very accepted to talk like this. We should all be tolerant, right? But really, isn't it actually very important to know the truth in almost all of life? I won't get very far believing I can put water in my gas tank and still get me across town will I? You can believe what you want, but it's not going to change the truth, and you'll find that out soon enough when try to start your water fueled car! So really, a story like this does nothing for me, because in the end, there is objective truth and when we die we'll have to face it, whatever it is.
Great recollection Derek!
The atheist has probably read the following famous statement by Richard Dawkins:
"We are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed in. Some of us just go one god further."
Super fascinating! And what a lovely story.
Amen brother Jack
Ah love it. The duality of the two people. I'd love to find out what happened to them as the night went on.
I think that's a big problem with most folks nowadays is that they are unable (or perhaps more accurately unwilling) to at least admit to a different viewpoint. It doesn't mean your viewpoint is wrong or bad or that the other person's is wrong or bad JUST that you have a differing opinion.
I'm always reminded of the stories of Ronald Reagan and Tip O'Neil in the 80's. Very different politically but at the end of the day they realized the had to work together and things were accomplished.
That is how progress is made step by step and embrace by embrace.
As always Derek I love reading these blogs for a refreshing look on things.
My Best as always
If you knew enough about all the spiritual mythologies of our collective past, you would probably never have a moment in any day that wasn't known to you to be particularly sacred. Maybe that's why Joseph Campbell always seemed so effortlessly a holy man.
Also, most synchronously, check out the introduction ( for free)
of my new book The Street Corner Ching, at Open Books Press.
I love the ancient man,I always fall back on them will I need understanding. One ancient man saw that people was worshiping everything,everything was a God and even today,most things are named for ancient Gods, it don't never quit...Good story Derek..
Jesus: "There is no other other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."
Acts 4:12
I was so into mythology as a kid so, yeah, I knew about Thors Day but, I really loved the perspective of agreeing about 519 gods. And, I've just spent the last week 'googling' info on mythology for my 9 yr old son who inherited my fascination with mythology and wants to visit some sites of mythological significance while we visit Europe this Summer. So, this blog fits in nicely with my week. Thanks!
hmm....even agreeing to the idea of ONE God doesn't indicate anything agreed about the attributes or purpose of that God.
....bit like blind men describing an elephant by feel.
hooray for 'shared values'.... if only there were some discussion about what those values actually mean.
Nice. But I think there`s another name for that, called maturity.
Looks like I'll have to revisit Oregon if the conversations are that interesting!
HAHAHAHAHA. I'm sure the band conversation was much longer.
Written for rabbit!
Indeed. Focussing on what we have in common rather than our differences would put a stop to many wars. When it comes to God or the Infinite or Eternity or the All the 'names' are all but a 5 second google search. Beyond comprehension, beyond words, beyond petty arguments.... just a being and sharing in the moment. hmmmmmmm but your favorite band??? hmmmm that's different : ) but then I am a musician : )
Hey Derek,
Cool post, man!
One thing I've always found fun is to translate weekdays into other languages (my native tongue is French).
French pretty much gives away how the days of the week are tied to planets -- then, in turn, deities.
Lundi (Monday): Lune (Moon)
Mardi (Tuesday): Mars
Mercredi (Wednesday): Mercure (Mercury)
Jeudi (Thor's day): Jupiter
Vendredi (Friday): Venus
Weekend doesn't match as well...
Martin
Funniest story I've read today.
Thanks for the great post Derek!
Silly story, and shows a shallow perspective that too easily dismisses thought toward any kind of absolute truth. Possibly we might try the idea that absolute truth is too important to fight about, but ought to be mutually discovered, instead of dismissed as transitory and not worry of our time! Let's talk about nothing instead. hmmm. yeah,the latest wanna be band.
What a great conversation.
An addition to:
Wednesday= mercredi (in French) The day of Mercury.
Thursday= Jeudi(Fr.), Giovedi(It.) The day of Jupiter.
Thank you Derek for bringing this symbology of the weekdays into discussion.They were named after the seven visible moving "heavenly particles" according to their symbological characterisation of a deity.
"I love that we're living in a time where it's so easy to learn."... me too, Derek... me too!
Another famous relevant quote, from Stephen F. Roberts:
"I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."
once again you hit it right ...with a big Thor Hammer...hahhahaha...Thanks! Have fun on your travels and keep us posted!
Yes it's easier to access information in the digital age. Bad information as well as good.
Wikipedia... hmmm
The conversation, however, is moronic.
The answer to "Do you believe in God?" is not "Yes" or "No," but:
"What do you mean by the term 'God'?"
If what the "believer" meant was the God of Christianity and Judaism (and many would include Islam), that God should have been described. Otherwise, how do you know whether you believe? Or what is being asked?
The argument may or may not have been "reframed" here... but the term God was never defined.
If God #520 is the God of Christianity (which, let's face it, we are supposed to assume here. This mug is one of those closed minded "Christians.") Then the difference between "God" and "gods" has to be dealt with pronto.
You can sound very clever, but you cannot win an argument when you are both talking about completely different concepts.
Counsellor to witness: "Do you believe the defendent is guilty?"
Witness "Of what?"
Everything is everything.
As the great Thunderclap Newman said (in the album version outro to their beautiful Something in the Air) "Life is just a game, you fly a paper plane, there is no end."
The single version... (just as beautiful)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k8zmkzshUvE
Derek, can I have the name of the restaurant please? Never get that kind of conversation to ear wig on where we are. Welcome back by the by, hope you had a wonderful time.
So, Derek.
What is your point of view?
"On the contrary, of the 519 gods I don't believe in, I still believe the original (and current) believers of those gods are on to something...that is, I see powerful evidence that most of mankind recognizes the existance of a higher power, but just hasn't quite found all the truth yet. And I believe in one God who is pure Love and allows mankind to find Himself in this bumbling way. I believe this because of the evidence I've seen and experienced. So we are, in fact, currently incompatible, since I live my life for my God and you, believing in no God, are ultimately living your life only for yourself."
Nice topic . Most people don't really have a thought in their head about the dieties that they were born into 'believing' ."Amen" segues into "pass the gravy" 4 or 5 times a year with family ,and in other countries , it's other dieties . Some world leaders have had the gaul to insinuate that "let's see who's god's bigger " or some such nonsense , at wartime , almost always favorite religious events .
These days a search for 'Jmmanuel' will find you details about 'Jesus', and I'm certain that the man himself would approve , and that people who feel that they are being loyal , would dissaprove .
Why is this relevant to music ? Because music educates and inspires , besides being the result of inspirations .
Got one for favourite music disagreements!
We all listen to music differently therefore meaning there is no bad form of music.
Hail Thor!
Hail Zeus!
Do you believe in God?
Which one(s)?
There are probably a lot more than 520 gods, so you have to pick your favorites
Oh, and don't forget the goddesses!
This is a good reason not to: "we couldn't help but listen"
I think you need less free time!
Devin THEME
www.d e v i n t h e m e.com
That person flipped the stick Derek. Everyone sees a different facet of the many facets of a diamond. This is why collaboration is often tantamount to success. Personally, I love to hear the collective opinions of my friends. Then, I have a consensual grasp on the best course of action due to the brainstorming effect. Ultimately, if it is my project, I still have final say. When a famous actress was asked how old she was she quickly replied, "How old do I have to be? She flipped the stick and brought her own slant right back at the producer who queried her. Lenny Paquette
Yeah!!! I can dig it when people believe in different gods and they want to talk about it..
However, I do take exception to those people,(especially government people who are way to powerful and arrogant),that want me to respect their beliefs, but want to trash mine; by wanting to do away with sacred things and Holidays: Thanksgiving, Christmas,crosses,spiritual emblems etc. that symbolize most Americans beliefs in Jesus Christ;along with Faith, Hope and Charity!Otherwise,that's why we live in America, we can believe what we want too.. That is, until it is taken away from us by Uncle Sam!!
I love differing viewpoints! I would no more pick my friends for their political and religious views than I would choose to eat only one flavor of food!
Great story Derek and good to see you back with your ever enlightening experiences...please continue when you get time as It's most inspirational and may the Honeymoon go on & on & on.
Cheers, Bill
Wow. I guess some people's beliefs aren't that important to them. To some people, it just doesn't matter whether you believe in God or not. I find that incredibly sad. Tragic, in fact. As for me I believe in a God who refers to Himself as the living god,who created man in His own image and according to His Word, all the other gods were created by man. If you don't believe that, that's your business but if you say you believe in God and you're getting involved with somebody who doesn't want to hear about Him,ever- you're belief's not that strong in the first place. I know this doesn't mean much to people who don't choose to believe in the Living God, but He means everything to me. He gave me my life in the first place, and sent his own son to die on a cross which is about the most painful, humiliating way to die concieved of by man at the time, in order to save me from going to hell because 1. I needed it and 2. He was the only person who could do it. and what does He ask for in return? That I acknowledge His Son and that I do what He says. To turn away from my sins, honor God and treat everyone the way I want to be treated. I can't imagine compromising my faith for someone just because I might be attracted to her. I'd rather be with a Christian girl whose not into music, or even someone whose a republican before I'd get romantically involved with an atheist. Some atheists are okay for friends, if they don't wanna talk about God I can always pray behind their backs, but I wouldn't want to live with one. Not to hurt anybody's feelings.
And also, this is the day the Lord hath made.. whatever you call it.
Good to hear from you Derek, happy-ness always to both
& thank you for sharing great articals, I'm glad to live in a land where we still have freedom of religion.
reff:http://bible.cc/philippians/2-11.htm
Good to hear from you Derek, happy-ness always to both
& thank you for sharing great articals, I'm glad to live in a land where we still have freedom of religion.
reff:http://bible.cc/philippians/2-11.htm
I'm tho thor from laughing!
All Gods are just imaginary friends.
Flat car batteries?...don't get me started!!
It's amazing to me how "believers" hold on to the one god concept. I once believed how I was raised, until I saw life for what it really is... acceptance. Face it, born againers, there are millions of people on this planet who have no idea what "born again" means. The biggest assault on my faith occurred when I realized how much suffering goes on in this world. That's when I wondered how The one god of love could love his faithful so much he chooses to punish them.
Good one Derek.
Sometimes you need to stir the pot to get the ingredients to work together.
Hope the guy (assuming the atheist being male) will be able to convert her out of Christianity. Otherwise this will be a very difficult relationship. I know this because I used to be a devout Christian myself until I discovered Wikipedia & TED. I just wanted to find the truth and investigate science and history. Now my Christian friend tells me that I was never truly a believer. So I guess God didn't chose me, and that is fine with me! There is no excuse today for Christians who can read English not to examine and research about their own religion and its claims.
Hey Derek,
What you doing posting? Great hearing from you. Wondered how you were doing. Wow, the replys are almost as good as your original. Have a great time together...Jack
@James Ranka:
Here are some reasons:
• God loves mankind so much that He gave us utter and total free will, to do whatever we please good or bad, and suffer the rewards or consequences of said actions. Much of our suffering comes at the hands of evil and selfish folk, not by the hand of God. And God does not rescue the good folk from the effects of the bad folk, because to do so would be to take away our freedom of will in how we respond to the bad folk, in heart and mind as well as deed.
• It is, often, just a test. How can God know someone's constancy to Him without a little trial to find out?
• it builds discipline, and challenges our will. Ask any drill seargent.
• What is the Christian story? God delivers us from suffering in the end, we will live in joy for all eternity. In the meantime, he became man in the person of Jesus and endured the worst suffering to both show us how to endure it gracefully and to join with us in solidarity: He has become one of us to understand our pain and give us power through faith to endure it.
• Suffering reveals to us that we can't endure life without Him, and that there must be something better...it points us down the path to Heaven.
Well, maybe Gods die just like people do. Perhaps Gods need people to believe in them, to pray to them in order to live.
You didn't already know the days of the week are named after Roman gods? I'm surprised. The Roman gods are more or less the Greek gods given a less artistic and more war-mongering slant. When the Roman Empire rose they overlaid their own god names onto already popular mythology. Repeated it with Christianity which is why Christian stories and rituals have pagan origins much to the denial and dismay of the devout (Right-wingers). Some Norse gods in their too, like Thor. We've inherited a war loving culture from the early conquerors of Europe.
"All religion is true when interpreted as myth (metaphor). When you interpret it as fact then you're in trouble," said Joseph Campbell. Sadly, the debate is usually over which metaphor is the correct history. None of them are, they're all metaphor and that's where their truth lays.
Fascinating conversation. Amazing how the person turns it around from a disagree to 99% agreement.
Other learning... stay away from the topic of religion on the first date
BTW- love the Lego Thor. Where was that when I was a kid.
Everyone who assumed the atheist was the guy put up your hands.
I mean was it?
Thanks so much for sharing this. It is fascinating, especially the part about the two minds merging over love.
Also overheard in a restaurant:
Mother: "Why are you picking the sesame seeds off of your hamburger bun and putting them on that napkin?"
Young son: "Mom, I am going to take these seeds home so we can grow our own hamburgers!"
Even though that is the exact same photo you have had on your blog forever, now that I know you are a newly wed you look kind of extra happy! Isn't that strange. Same pic!
It is indeed quite a privilege to be living in a time where technology, information and knowledge have exploded. I grew up in the 60's and 70's and the world was quite different then. We were lucky because we had a telephone lol. Believe it or not, we actually had to WRITE A LETTER in order to talk to my grandparents 300 miles away! I know, shocking.
As a Christian, and working to become an ordained minister, I'm confused about why God (Jehovah, the God of the Holy Bible)was left off of the list. Don't get me wrong, I don't go around 'telling' people what to believe, but I have found that more and more the only faith that is ok to criticize or dismiss is Christianity. And yes, I am fully aware that there are ignorant and insensitive people who 'call' themselves Christians who call other faiths names and mock them. I don't have to believe in a particular faith/belief in order to have high respect/regard for the individual. And yes, I am an evangelical, so I do 'SHARE' my belief, but I will never strong-arm anyone to persuade them.
I'm not on a soapbox, or behind a pulpit but, I truly would like to see people be respectful of us. But, the fact is this is a good example of what is going on lately. The person talking about the gods clearly dismissed the one God Christian's serve, but accepted the other 519 during this conversation on the date...I call this intolerance. Why doesn't anyone take offense for me when we are treated as children who don't "understand?"
Not looking for an argument or to be offensive to anyone...so please don't be haten if you disagree with me....just respect my right to an opinion, a belief in MY GOD. Thanks for the opportunity to comment, Derek.
I too like to have conversations about things like this, but I truly fear for our belief system in the years to come...
Dio non è nei libri,per trovarlo basta alzare gli occhi al cielo ed accordare il cuore con l'universo.Solo allora si potrà suonare e cantare la canzone più dolce e più bella del mondo!
@Mme. Rosser:
"but I have found that more and more the only faith that is ok to criticize or dismiss is Christianity"
If it makes you feel better, I consider all religions absurd. I know the most about Christianity, however, having been raised in a country that is predominantly Christian.
"The person talking about the gods clearly dismissed the one God Christian's serve, but accepted the other 519 during this conversation on the date."
...what? I think you need to go read it again. The atheist on the date was pointing out that he dismisses all 520 gods, not that he accepts 519 of them but dismisses Yahweh. He was pointing out that he dismisses all 520, but his theist date only dismisses 519 of them.
c'mon, don't leave us hanging! what was his/her favourite band? what happened next or did you tune out? ... did they hook up? whens the sequel to this post?
I dive on TED and found one of your talks and then dive on your bio and then search your name on twitter and after a few mails i was reading this post and learning about your week days etymology.
Today it's so easy to learn and it feels so good!
The Sufis had a story they told on Thursdays called Mushkil Gusha (see the book "Caravan of Dreams" - can't remember the author)which was accompanied by the eating of dates (the kind that come from date palm trees). The story helped the spiritual seeker to keep sacred at least one day of the week, and to remember that "when your need is greater than your want, Mushkil Gusha (Spirit)will appear and remove all your difficulties" The story itself has a special rhythm to it that is part of the spiritual nature of the message.
I'm a sucker for a twist on a happy ending. Your story made me smile, Derek. Fascinating etymology as well.
"So what's your favorite band?" hahahahahahaa
He's got game.
~ but she's got ''the weapon'' . . .
L A M M Y aka Mr. True
As a swede so have Thor a place in our viking mythology and it is an pagan religion,where thor rides the sky and hammer away, there are still alot of people that are into Asa/(which the religion it,s called)and thor is just one figure,but he got his own day..there is a symbol that a lot of poeple has as neckles and that is a copy of a original viking neckles with a thor hammer,,is it a religion to belieave in..nahh..well.. a pagan one.and a fun story to read..ps..his horse as famous as him self by the way..but to big to have around the neck.
ceep hammering away on thursdays,,
cheers
r
that's hilarious! great story.
Just learnt a lesson!
we focus on one little aspect and judge not being compactible in a relationship, whereas we miss hell lot of things we are compactible in!
Thanks for a great story!
Your sharing always amazes me! What a special gift you are for all of us Derek! Much love and blessings!
How did Saturn make it into Norse calendar?
Bravo, Great work Derek!!!!!
Great story, interesting perspective.
i had one answer to the question "what do you want to be when you grow up, little boy?"
i wanted to be thor!
well, that didn't happen but i have indeed hammered my way through nearly 60 employers in my lifetime and perhaps the biggest reason is, exactly like you, i delight in playing advocatus diabolous. i've learned, painfully so, that people immediately presume you are indeed speaking from attachment to, agreement with, the words you're speaking.
and yes, every new and unknown tidbit becomes one more thing i have to go look-up, research, find out more about, etc.
now, where did i leave that hammer?
Hmmm . . .
I observe that when a group of folks search for an answer to the question of "why", "life" or "does God exist" you have a situation like the following metaphor:
Imagine a room, the only egress of which is by hitting a target, with a crowd of people standing behind it telling which way to aim your arrow. Each person in tern is blindfolded, spun around then gets to take a shot. A miss means the archer joins the crowd. A hit means the archer gets to leave the room. The accuracy of the information of the group, their level of agreement, and whether they know/understand the nature of both the target and the archer, as well as the archer's own skill set (including listening) determine whether the target is hit, several arrows lost or simply several people hurt/killed. Each person (archer) may have their own quiver of arrows made up of his/her perceptions/beliefs regarding the details of the story Derek told. In the final analysis, whether or not the proverbial "target" (deeper meaning or "truth") is hit is all that matters, but ultimately the responsibility of that outcome lies with the archer.
Still, sometimes, the unexpected removal of a blindfold can be both frightening and useful at the same time.
If only most people could be so REASONABLE!!!!!
Well I learnt from this havent studied 520 Gods the Christians say we are only allowed to know one theirs... I didnt know about the God day names where have I been... Yep I will have to study some more... Its great to listen to others yea inspiring sometimes Thanks Ken
That is just so cool.. I laughed out loud.. Wow, real adults.. great stuff.. LOL
That's an awesome good example of that there is always an alternative view of things/situations/problems - whatever !
thanks for sharing !!!
.R
For those who merely believe God exists, dismissing him over dinner for a potential boyfriend or girlfriend could be no big deal. Why not? The devil and the demons also believe he exists, yet they foolishly ditched him for what they thought would be a better deal. But for me and those like me who know and love our God with all our hearts, minds, souls and strength, we would never even consider being so foolishly and unequally teamed with someone who denied his existence. Nothing could pry our faith or its importance from us. Our conversation would have ended with "Let's just be friends."
There's no doubt in the world of other spirit's that speak,control and capture the hearts,minds and souls of many today. In all of the readings and conversion about this topic,Ive never heard but one say I AM the truth and the light and no man comes to the Father [ meaning the father of all gods] but by me.This is bold and moving at the same time. I like this GOD !
Of course there is only One Oneness!
Love it! Posting a link to this on my blog.
Just don't call it research. That rubs me the wrong way for some reason... "Do some research."
I think "research" should be harder than doing an internet search.
I guess I'm old now.
There is but one true God, made up of the Father, Son and Holy Spitit. You must believe in faith, without faith, you can not please God. Jesus, the Son, came to tell us of God's plan to save man, but man crucified Him, which had to happen to fulfill God's plan. It's all in the bible, just read it, believe it to salvation or reject it to your destruction.
Does this guy work in advertising? LOL.
Nice. I have an encyclopedia of 2,000 gods compiled by Michael Jordan (not the basketball player). So much for monotheism.
Jeff Wave
There are too many folks
on this earth as it is
whose hearts lay dormant
in a pain filled abyss-
(Who am I to rage against them?)
"Above all, love one another"
best words I ever read-
no misinterpretation there
I try to do like He said-
(Reference from a good book.)
I do not wish to offend
by what I do believe
but what kind of faith
to be found in conformity-
(Engulfed by fire and brimstone?)
Give me a shady spot
with a comfortable seat
come and sit beside me friend
and we'll agree to disagree-
(Respectful of each other's opinion.)
Until you've waded through the waters of Hell, lost your home, your family, your everything...you truly have not met god. He/she will reveal themselves to you on the dark night...and there will be no argument, no reasoning with fools after. You will know and your heart and head will open to all and everything. Only love is real all else is a smoke screen of fear. Any book, leader, document that tries to coerce by fear and manipulation...well, you be the judge, think for your self. (It's OK, really...no lightening strikes, only clarity.)
My partner is very religious, and I too in my own way believe in the sacred- but to my own eyes, experiences...everything is holy now. Imagine what the world might be if we looked at it like that. He goes to church and I go to the woods. And we agree to disagree.
Our first date sounded much like the conversation above...
My rambling thoughts here after reading many others responses was to think of what I would have said in the conversation you overheard. My question to the either of them would be... Do you recognize the sacred in all of life or at least it's value? For me, it's not about the personality we assign to deity, it's about life, the planet, each-other, we're all "God" or sacred or some name that refers to spirit that connects all things/beings. For a personal example, I look at the trees, flowers, squirrels etc. in my back yard and feel a connection with them internally. Some would say this is delusion and others would say this is factual. I'm just honoring my own experience and if others don't experience this I'm ok with that except for one thing... The consequence to feeling disconnected from Life, for whatever reason, is most often a non-valuing of that life, the results of which we experience in the pollution and destruction of our life support system here on Earth. If our Atheist feels connected to Life then that person, being non-religious, might be MORE inclined to protect our life-support system here. My response is based on putting myself in the conversation you heard. Thanks for sharing it. It helps me to clarify why I LOVE the fact that the days of the week are named for deities... sacred in all things... even the names we give our days!
What a great thought to start the day on! I'm sharing this with EVERYONE I know.
That is Germanic (teutonic) history, Derek, pre Christian times. I am from Northern Germany, Hamburg to be exact.
Great writing.
Perhaps the atheist is confused by what religions are "saying" God is...and haven't yet experienced God?...
I prefer this instead:
"God has no religion".
~~Ghandi
My friend Malcolm Tent owns trash american style , trash records and is an authority on punk music. His friend has a band called THOR dressing rather vikinglike. While malcolms band is the Bunny Brains.
Your blogs are always tops, Derek. thanks.
I like reading your posts. . and the most moving statement you have made is , "The rest of our life will be our honeymoon".
If You go to:
"Jesus Christ's Grave"
He's Not There !
Because of His Resurection !
He physically Resurected from His Grave.
That's mind Blowing !
This totally Freaks Me Out.
I Believe in Him because I was a drunk and he helped Me with My addiction I dabbled in a few other Religious Philosiphy's 'n' Now that I've had a taste of His Love.
I know He's Real.
He's supernaturally alive !
YEA !
There is no Doubt in My Mind, Heart 'n' Soul.
And I'm never going to back I'm not embarassed to Say that
"I Love Jesus "
I used to know about Him, 'n' now I know him as a friend.
He talks to Me through His Word
The Bible and through musical worship through people ect.
I've even written songs for Him 'n' about Him some of which are expereinces that I have had because of Him.
I know He Has Forgiven Me.
I'm more assured of His promise for eternal Life.
Eternal Life what a promise.
I have video called
"I Believe"
on My website youtube 'n' tangle" links:
This is My personal experience that I've had and it's real.
Thank You for the oppourtunity to comment.
Deric
God Bless !
Carey
This is fine. But, I don't think it's a conversation that would ever conclude as it did. And, I don't think it will change minds. But, who knows? Maybe it would.
... And, that goes for the comment before mine as well as the article.
Very much fun. I'd have to say your are BETTER THAN WATCHING OPRAH. Not that I watch Oprah.
Nice picture too.
That was very clever on the part of the atheist to look at the agreement on all those other gods. I grew up in an extended family of extreme conservatives, in every way, but my father is a very worldly liberal. They don't even talk to each other, and I was very confused about issues of religion and spirituality for a long time. Nothing anyone said seemed "right" to me, so I did a lot of reading. I remember one early experiment I did when I was a kid, when some of those relatives told me that the Bible was absolutely perfect, and everything in it was true. I wanted to know if they were right or not, but there was no library anywhere near, and I had no other way to check what it said against science or any other way of seeing things. So I checked it against itself. If it was perfect, then it should not contradict itself. Boy did I find contradictions! When I mentioned that to my aunt, she went ballistic. I never said anything about that again.
That was then and this is now. Now we have the internet.
One of the resources I used extensively to learn about these things has been the internet, ever since I got my first 14K dial up modem, and "040" Mac, in 1994. I learned that there are a lot of belief systems out there, and compared to many of them, my relatives' beliefs were downright weird. Even some of the UFO cults made more sense. Of course there is Asatru, where those Norse gods still live today. All of this is interesting, and some if it is really beautiful. One of the most beautiful works on religion and spirituality is the Urantia book. I have not seen all of it, but someone I knew had a copy and I did some reading there as well. After all of this, I still don't know the answer. I am neither atheist or religious, and I am still curious. I do have some very solid spiritual principles which I live by, and feel a strong conviction that this world could be almost like Heaven if everyone did, but I have no idea how to make that happen. Jesus tried to do that, and so did Buddha. If they can't do it, I don't see how I can.
Basically what I learned is that there 3 kinds of people, those who think they already have all the answers, those who don't care, and seekers like me. It's best not to talk about any of these things with anyone who is not a fellow seeker.
I will probably spend a lot of time reading this. There are a lot of interesting posts here from other people.
Look it up on WIKIPEDIA?!
Everything you 'know' is something you read, you experienced, or something someone told you. You CHOOSE what you believe. What Wikipedia, Encyclopedia and all other books have NOT done is predict what's going on now. Hell is REAL..and forever is a long time. I pray you choose life.
Romans 1:18"The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, (19)since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. (20)For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are WITHOUT excuse."
I knew you were taking the year off to travel, but I didn't know you got MARRIED. CONGRATULATIONS!!! I hope you two are as happy as my wife and I are together, forever.
From my current paradigm, I believe it is the total collection of all opinions that makes the whole. I think it is important to see this without judgement (*Buddha) as I believe this is what creates the total "god" we are.
So everyone is always correct! or not...and it doesn't matter. *Neal Donald Walsh
It only matters how we each (the individual ego) relate to each other as we work to arrive (as the whole). *Krishnamurti
From that perspective, this story was great example to show a simple "how to be" with each other.
I am also neither atheist or religious, but a seeker and even as I contradict myself, I also agree that it's best not to talk about any of these things with anyone who is not a fellow seeker as we must first understand how to work to be awakened. * GI Gurdjieff
*Final note - It is very challenging to create our "own thoughts" on this or many subjects which in itself calls attention to observe closer the mind as well as being outside the mind!
I never talk about religon to anyone.The bible speaks of humans that were sons of God.Angels came down and had childern by the women of the land.They grew to be bullies.God had to destroy them.The story is in the bible.The flood took care of that.To me reglion is a chain around the masses neck.I belive in GOD.Someone who created all things.I just dont belive in people telling me what he said as if I cant read.
Last night me and my wife went to see a movie. She suggested a short cut which I agreed to. The parking lot was pretty full so we had to park a few levels up. No problem I thought, we've still got twenty minutes before the movie starts. My wife got out of the car and pretty much slammed the door and started walking. Ok, I thought. When we got out of the elevator she took off toward the movie theater with me ambling behind. We were seeing IronMan2 and there were at least six screens showing the movie. "It's on number 6" she said when I caught up, and took off again. When we got there they said 'No, it's on screen number 10'. By now my wife, who has asthma, was having a hard time, and asked where the elevator was as she couldn't deal with the stairs.
Seeing her discomfort I said,"What's up hon?" She said"I don't like being late." I said "We're not late." and showed her the ticket I had bought online. The movie started at 10.30pm, she thought it started at 10.00pm. I smiled and said "It's ok, you can relax." I watched her process the information for a few seconds and then her whole body relaxed. Later, as we sat in our seats she said "I feel stupid. Insta-bitch." I said, "Don't worry about it, it's ok."
See, she truly believed the movie started at 10.00pm. In her mind I was being a slowcoach, uncaring, etc etc. She was mad at me. I could totally forgive that because I could see for her it was true.
But it made me realise something. A belief system is valid for the person who believes it, period. Doesn't matter what that belief is. Pagan, atheist, Christian, Jew, Muslim, Buddhist, Satanist, Communist, Capitalist, Socialist, Democrat, Republican, Patriot etc etc etc. If the person believes it, it must be true, for that person.
I could go on about the ills of the world but I'd be preaching to the choir.
Thanks for everything Derek, great article.
Viking weekday present weekday Norrønt (Old Norse)
Sun day Sunday Sunnudagr
Moon day Monday Mánadagr
Tyr's day Tuesday Týsdagr
Odin's day Wednesday Óðinsdagr
Thor's day Thursday Þórsdagr
Freja's day or Friggs-dag Friday Frjádagr
Løver day (=washing day, bathing day) Saturday Laugardagr
I translated this poem into English for my first stage performance outside of Europe (in DC), and I feel humbled by the guy in the story, who makes room for her belief system alongside of his own, without compromising neither his or her belief: I now believe there IS a way to have a discussion, or a talk, with a fanatic.
--
THE INITATOR OF A HUG GETS TO LET GO
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Islam as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Christianity as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Buddhism as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Sufism, Judaism, Hinduism as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Capitalism as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Liberalism, Socialism, Sex as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Ecology as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Family as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Class Division as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Personal Empowerment as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees One Nation, One Education as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Automobilism, Two-wheelerism or Pedestrianism as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Self-caught Food or Vaccuum Packaging as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Love as the only right way, is not possible. Or Aggression for that matter too.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees the Way of the Warrior or the Healer as the only right way, is not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees him or herself as the only right way, is not possible, full stop.
No, wait...!
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Discussion as the only way and unity as the only result, is not possible, so what do I do?
What do I do, when I cannot talk my way to terms of being here, both of us?
Do I sleep badly at night from fear or anger? Do I ignore them?
Do I take their unwillingness as a threat in itself? Do I try to understand them, embrace them, become the one to create the space inside of me and my world for those, who have no room for me?
Am I the warrior just waiting for the cup to be filled, or the healer, whose cup never runneth over?
Or am I the Man in the middle, endlessly pondering which of the two I actually ought to be, now, right now!?
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Faith as the only way? Not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who sees Doubt as the only way? Not possible.
Having a discussion with someone, who has all bases covered, just isn't possible.
There is only one way.
Find it yourself.
Great, great story. Thank you for using it to make this point. Derek, you are absolutely amazing at clearly arguing the side of open mindedness and dare I say LOVE in the world. This kind of clear thinking reminds me of your previous article about not punishing all for one persons mistake http://sivers.org/punish
You are the champion of "out of the box" thinking. Bravo!
-Lars
As a 'confirmed' Agnostic I would just like to say that: I gotcher "Thor" right here.
The defendant ended with "oh God", which to me suggests (I'm betting "she")rightly felt that her belief in God had been minimized to "almost atheistic", and that any opinion she would voice on bands would also be flippantly dismissed. These two can only get along if she is willing to bow to his opinion. Like Angelica and her invisible cream, the differences of opinion have to be dealt with at some point.
I know of a couple who decided when they married that the girls would be Christian and the boys would be Jewish. Any differences can be managed if getting along is important enough, hopefully to both parties, not that one is always giving up their rights to another.
I agree with the person who said that all truths are not equal. I believe in God, not only because I see the sun rise, but because by it I see everything else. Thanks go to Jack for holding up a truth too powerful to deny the importance of. Everything matters in the end.
“You're an atheist? How can you not believe in God?”
“How can you not believe in Zeus or Thor?...They were God!"
###
'nuf said...and well said at that.
Hilarious and quoteworthy enough for that sole reason, but what I liked best was the moral of the story.
Personally, I believe that disagreements are most healthy. If an opposing point of view makes us re-examine our own, there's really no better way to continue learning.
As for learning, permit me to quote Confucius, as I know no better words to express the underlying wisdom:
"The Master said, 'Learning without thought is labour wasted; thought without learning is perilous.'"
- Confucian Analects, Book II, Chap. XV
These days, when knowledge is more accessible than ever and it is incredibly simple to make our voice heard, we should take this message to heart.
God is All That Is
My friend Malcolm Tent owns trash american style , trash records and is an authority on punk music. His friend has a band called THOR dressing rather vikinglike. While malcolms band is the Bunny Brains.
I agree wholeheartedly - being a research geek, there's a special pain associated with the "so into this" effect. It's handy living in a time when having the answers themselves is less important than knowing the process to finding the answers available.
Seriously, this made my day.
Very entertaining and informative story.
Truth and freedom hold hands..
Hey Derek!! Hope you are both having a wonderful time!!
Rachel
make me laughing. Derek. how can this lovely conversation into your ears? It's one of your best writing, like beautiful movie. It's just that innocent, and cute of both of them. I love them both.
i believe in God. but sometimes i worry if i could reach to the Galaxy if i couldn't get on the scientific space ship which could reach to 98% light's speed, and take about 80 light years to travel to there.
i wish God is not too far to reach.
how about your marrige life? tell us some jokes please.
manjia new albums :
http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/manjialuo#
;
Wondered how the honeymoon was going.....
Welcome back to the Oregon coast.
Hi Derek !
Thank much for the comments.
Very respectly.
Oyonada Bekale
Great story. If more people can look at the other people of the world and think that they agree 519 out of 520 times instead of focusing on the 1 they disagree about the world we be a better place.
I love looking things up and learning about almost anything but I caution that people find a more reputable place than Wikipedia.
I'm wondering why my generation missed the boat and didn't use the saying "Make Frige, not Mars."
...
I suppose my view on religion is that our human perception is so narrow and God is so great, that we try to put God in a out tiny little "human box" and try to define him in ways that's comfortable for us...I was watching John Edward (medium) on TV and a celebrity he was giving a "reading" to asked him..."Do you believe in God." John Edward answered "Yes." The celebrity asked a second question "Which one do you believe in?" (and I LOVED his answer) which was "I was unaware that there was more than just one!"
Very Best Regards,
George
thank you for sharing, Derek!
To me it's very funny how many Christians don't realize that most of their traditions, rituals and stories are "borrowed" from earlier religions, and how quickly the Christians dismiss those religions as "silly".
What Exist Above (The Heavens) Exist Below (On Or In The Earth) Hence The Star Of DAVID, Or The Seal Of Solomon Or The Two Triangles One Pointing UP, The Other Pointing Down, A Hexagram. "In The Earth", Would Be Inside Us As Human Beings Or Speaking Spirits, Religions Bind While The Spirit Of God, That Exist In Us, Can & Will Ultimately Free Us!
From Ignorance, That Leads Us To Create Religions !!
I've Opted To Embrace Islam, Simply To Recognize The Giving Of Thanks, Five Times A Day At Least Is Compatible To My Spirit, To Do Good Deeds Daily..... A Refute Tyranny That Destroys The Human Spirit, Or The Spirit Of God In Man !! We Think We Know, Yet It Is Most Important To READ, & Study That We May One Day Have An Idea !!
This Too Is Taught In Islam ...... As The Angel Gabriel Spoke To Muhammad "READ IN THE NAME OF YOUR GUARDIAN LORD"
The Hieroglyphs In Egypt, Have Opened Much Knowledge & Man Created Many Religions,& Tech. Yet The Hieroglyphs Of Ethiopia Have Never Been Deciphered , There In Is The Truth Of The Spirit Of God In Man & Many More Greater Technologies , This Knowledge Is Hidden For A Reason, Their Are Some CHILDREN ( Sons Of Man) That Would Only Create Destruction ......... As We Have Well Seen, They Have Yet To Evolve Spiritually ! Should They Embrace ISLAM It Would accelerate Their Process Spiritually !!
The Hieroglyphs Of Ethiopia Are Encoded In The DNA Of the Original Man......... Some Of Us Actually Live & Breath This Knowledge, Wisdom & Understanding & Technology.......
Some Sons Of Man Call It Alien Tech. !!
A Hint To The Truth In Physics Is " DARK MATTER" & "DARK MASS" !!
Enough Said !
Ya, I like this article. I once met an atheist who said he had a problem with God. So I asked, how can you have a problem with someone who doesn't exist?
After reading Carlos Costonaza's book "The teaching of Don Juan/A Yaqi Way of Knowledge" I'm convinced the Judeo/Christian god is some other worldly monster devouring the unsuspecting souls of the recently departed.
Interesting reading nothing is good or bad
cool and i believe
Everyone longs for connection to "something else out there". Some people call "it" God, some "Allah", some "Thor".
Some are so turned off by what man does to the Spiritual the moment they give it "their" name that they become atheists.
But - these people still love to feel connected and try to find it in a different way - through music, drugs, nature, etc.
And that is just fine as long as they find it.
Thanks for the story and thanks for making me aware of the Thor movie - that makes my inner 12-year old REAL happy!
Hmmm. newlyweds on the Oregon coast having a romantic dinner together and focus on the couple nearby; time to look into each other's eyes again.....
Hi Derek!
I really like this article.
Best, Richard
So, that's why I Love Wednesdays. It's the ode to Odin: The Grand Poobah!! It all makes sense.
"The gods that did not make the heavens and the earth will perish from the earth and from under the heavens" (Jer 10:11) Simple, huh?
This is awesome. Love it.
Just a minor technical comment--
While most of us pronounce "Wednesday" as wensday or wensdee, my maternal grandmother, an Irish girl from the Sault Ste. Marie area of Minnesota, where she was surrounded by Scandinavians who took Woden seriously, always carefully pronounced that first "d" in Wednesday.
It didn't become wednessday;
the "n" after it became what the linguistics types call a "syllabic
n" like the one in "didn't."
I gather this is not all that uncommon, but she is the only one I've ever known who did it.
"...And because I invested so little time into it, I'm emotionally less invested into subscribing to it .."
Considering the potential ups and downs of this approach - Do you think this is the corollary to "no pain no gain"? Do we need to strive to achieve something in order to feel responsible for it? Is the "just look up the answer "approach a fore runner of the attitude that the actual answer is irrelevant because we hadn't been required to judge or be responsible to discover the meaning ourselves?
As in, is there a difference if one covers a song or if one writes the song. Which has one become more invested in? Does it make a difference to the care and professionalism one then gives imbues in the song? If the pot of gold was in arms reach, would we ever stretch our limits?
...just seems this "access to data" coin has three sides ...
Derek,
You are supposed to be on honeymoon,and travelling,but it's good to hear from you.
Well!i didn't know any of that stuff,but i do now.Thanks for the education.
Happy travels.
Pete
You are so right, Technology has provided us with tools (the internet and computers)that can greatly enhance our lives. This is why I've started a non profit mobile unit to teach basic computer skills to the underserved neighborhoods and facilities. This is in order to make avaliable this necessary resources that are vital to enhance your avaliability to knowledge in todays tech sociaty.
LOL! What a fantastic dialogue! Thank you again for another great post.
Enjoyed the conversation too. "The Case for a Creator" starring, Lee Strobel, science proving the existence of God, it is very informative.
Thanks Derek, I wonder what the gods are thinking.
Ive been with all types of people in my life.
So, I can say, I believe in God and Angel's because I have experience them.I guess I am very lucky in that way.
Some people, have to see things in order to believe.
But one thing, we could all have in common is love.and "isn't that what God is all about".
Much Love and Light
Richard Spasoff
Well pointed out. Love this.
I'm going to hazard a guess that the atheist was a male and the christian a female.
:P
interesting story, those 2 definitely have some wild times ahead. as do you! congrats on your recent wedding.
Wow, this is my fav article you have ever posted! No wonder people tell me I should move to Oregon, as I'm extremely like the person who doesn't believe in 520 gods, except that it bothers me that everyone else seems to be like the other person. Guess I'll try to remember the its just 520 vs 519. Thanks for posting!
Although, I think this is an over simplification. Many have died and suffered for not believing in various gods.
Wow, Derek - you really stirred up a hornet's nest. Amazing how many people still don't comprehend the truth.
Jesus Christ warned there would be many false christs,(like some of the "gods" and "goddesses" mentioned in this reply section).
God the Father created everything in six days and rested on the seventh day. The days of the week were originally the first day, second day, etc. Centuries later, people started naming days after false gods, such as Thor.
Interesting to see how many lost souls have responded to this article. The only ones who are aware of the truth are Lana Perry, Carey B. Grant,Everett Adams, Joe Romeo, Gerald, and Jack. I hope you listen to these people and ignore all the ignorant ones.
Brilliant story! Thanks for sharing!
omg! this is GREAT! fantastic! ;p gonna share the info on my facebook page. thanks Derek!
Hey Derek, loving that you use your blog as an demonstration project ie. the web as educational tool. I was recently relating to a elderly friend how much I love the internet in the sense that I get to follow a path of discovery in much the same way a scientist does, digging deeper into a subject and following pathways my own mind might never know exist if it were not for the input of others via cyber space.
Great Zoose I'll go get hurk get hurk! lol
It's good to agree to disagree
The creators of the mythology were wise to keep it to a dull roar - only 519 Gods (then the other one makes 520).
BANDS on the other hand are a serious problem. THERE ARE TOO MANY BANDS. It's hard to separate the Cream from the Crap. When the LABELs ruled, there was a small amount of product, and a huge demand. Now, there's TOO MUCH PRODUCT and the demand is diluted.
Too many choices.
If they really were to talk about their favorite bands, the odds of them connecting are astronimical (like Thor is to Buddha).
.db.
Go Odin! Go Thor! Blessed BE!!!!!!! Bel Spellsinger www.spellsinger.us www.reverbnation.com/spellsinger
Wow! This is great! We can always find points on which we agree with those that we generally disagree, if we choose.
God is in the mind of the believer, as beauty is in the eye of the perceiver.
Hey, I like the American Indian view that Spirit is everywhere, in the rocks and trees, animals, wind and water, the sun, moon and stars, and in you and in me.
Well, maybe not in you, but definitely in me, hehe.
nice story. i knew where the days cam from since i was about ten years old - i was taught it in primary school
i do like the lego 'thor' too
Welcome to my world Derek!
I'm a Pagan High Priest of the Wiccan religion, and the music I record and distribute through CDBaby.com is Pagan/Wiccan. I'm currently working on my new album "Circle of Power" which is Pagan Techno Dance.
It's great to see a post about the Gods in context with the internet, information, and modern music.
That's me.
In fact, the 1st song I'm releasing from my new album digitally very soon through CDBaby.com is about "Prometheus". Look that one up. ;)
Bast Blessings!
Alexian
What a lovely eavesdrop - I gotta get out of NYC
I think love is looking into each others eyes too(comment), but my grandmother interestingly insisted that love is not looking into each others eyes, but standing shoulder to shoulder looking out at the world. Awwww. Perfect newlyweds, according to my grandmother....
Hey! Your guy at the other table was inspired on this TED Talk about atheism:
http://www.ted.com/talks/richard_dawkins_on_militant_atheism.html
At time 13:30 he explains "some people just go one god further".
By the way, great post! I love your blog
Hey dude you did it again...great read and too funny photo add. And you know what I think the old adage..."opposites do attract" seems to fit this pair. ;)
PS It's fun to eavesdrop, huh?
Derek, sorry I'm late on this great blog, as I was on vacation. My best to you and your bride. Religion is the greatest scourge and fraud ever perpetrated on the human race. All gods and all religions are created by the human mind's superstitious imagination. The mythology and history are all of academic interest but not to taken to mind nor heart.
Hi Derek,
Thanks for another amusing story...
I love the end:
"So what's your favorite band?"
"Oh, god"
...
Here you go stirring things up again. Amazing to me how many here see this as an interesting conversation by 2 intelligent people. As Bob Ryan states above: "The conversation, however, is moronic." A cute story? Sure. Thanks for posting it Derek. But as a debate for belief in God or an Atheistic attitude? My goodness, people, attempt a bit of real effort over a period of years to truly examine the issue. Read many real books. More than once. Attend to ancient sources, and attempt to understand them. Over the course of years of study, place yourself with others who can assist you in your quest. Don't be taken in by Glib Fools who use charm & humor instead of hard-fought-for knowledge. And please ignore politics in your quest - this is NOT an issue owned by conservative or liberal thinkers. However much they try to persuade you otherwise in THEIR quest for your vote.
Count me as a believer in God. And I sincerely hope some of the folks who chimed in here do a bit more examination on the question of the existance of God.
Peace & Harmony to all.
Humorous but sad. Government education has just completed the dumb down cycle as is evidenced here by a violation of the rules of logic to construct an argument. Both failed in their logic. Fallacy not detected. Neither understood.
In roman group of languages the connection between Gods and days of the week is even more apparent - Lundi, Lunes come from "luna" - the Moon, Mardi, Martes - from Mars, Mercredi, Miércoles - from Mercury, Jeudi, Jueves - from Jupiter, Vendredi, Viernes- from Venus, Samedi, Sabado- probably from Saturn,like Saturday, unless it has something to do with Sabbath. Dimanche, Domingo -obviously from latin Dominus.
Most probably that couple is heading nowhere,because his mind is flexible and playful, while hers is somewhat stiff and conservative.They might both end up feeling lonely and frustrated, despite all the inicial attraction.Opposits attract and eventually clash, unfortunately.Hope I am wrong, but most likely not.
And don't forget: A healthy self reflective analysis of blind faith should not stop with just religion. One can be equally devout with regard to Nation, team, clan, pastime (yes, Music too), money etc. Prioritizing what's truly important in life can help avoid conflict and remind us of our place on the planet. Fighting over an unprovable "theory" or even just a sports event seems the height of trivial.
Hmmm well,
I've hung out with Christians, Buddhists, Catholics, Pagans, Satanists, Luciferians,
and Atheists alike. In doing so it has been one aspect bringing me to one of my own personal quotes:
"The only significance anything in this Uni-verse (one-song) has, is only determined by the degree in which we measure it"
~Orpheos
One may have a Christian perspective on one particular subject whilst having a Satanic perspective on another so why stick a title on your forehead "I am a ____" ?
When we kill locally we are called criminals and when we kill across enemy lines we are called heroes. Is it not ultimately the same?
"Beliefs" are like flavors in Baskin Robins.
Everyone in there will tell you that their flavor is the best! But the bottom line is that they are all just sitting down eating ice-cream =^)
Are we not ourselves Gods with all of life's choices waiting for us to act upon? And who needs the pressure of living up to silly "titles" anyway?
Why pin yourself to the wall, when you can "be it all".
~o
Perspectives are my favorite things... sometimes i wonder if anything other than perspective exists... then again i read to many Quantum mechanics books...